Author |
Topic |
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maxpower1954
Cruiser Member
108 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2009 : 9:34:49 PM
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The fan on my R-2 GT Hawk spins about two seconds after shutdown -time for a new viscous fan drive!
Stude
part 1560257, but I KNOW there is a direct Mopar/Chrysler interchange,
because I did just that some years ago. But I can't find it in my
voluminous interchange lists. Does anybody know what it is? Yes, I
would normally get it from one of our friendly vendors, but I just had
a large order come in from SI; wanted to try locally first. Thanks,
Russ Farris |
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DEEPNHOCK
Commander Member
USA
6256 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2009 : 9:46:42 PM
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Russ... Are you sure that makes it bad? Just curious.. Jeff
quote: Originally posted by maxpower1954
The fan on my R-2 GT Hawk spins about two seconds after shutdown -time for a new viscous fan drive!
Stude
part 1560257, but I KNOW there is a direct Mopar/Chrysler interchange,
because I did just that some years ago. But I can't find it in my
voluminous interchange lists. Does anybody know what it is? Yes, I
would normally get it from one of our friendly vendors, but I just had
a large order come in from SI; wanted to try locally first. Thanks,
Russ Farris
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maxpower1954
Cruiser Member
108 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2009 : 10:20:08 PM
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Well, that's what I always thought, Jeff - it was supposed to stop
turning with the engine. That's what the one on my Avanti does, and
this one did also, until recently. Russ Farris |
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bige
Golden Hawk Member
USA
789 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2009 : 11:14:01 PM
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Pretty reliable inicator...
Also,
when you rev the engine a bad one will look like it's under a strobe
light like the way it looks when you're using a timing light.
ErnieR
quote: Originally posted by DEEPNHOCK
Russ... Are you sure that makes it bad? Just curious.. Jeff
quote: Originally posted by maxpower1954
The fan on my R-2 GT Hawk spins about two seconds after shutdown -time for a new viscous fan drive!
Stude
part 1560257, but I KNOW there is a direct Mopar/Chrysler interchange,
because I did just that some years ago. But I can't find it in my
voluminous interchange lists. Does anybody know what it is? Yes, I
would normally get it from one of our friendly vendors, but I just had
a large order come in from SI; wanted to try locally first. Thanks,
Russ Farris
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chamberlainbandad
Champion Member
USA
15 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2009 : 3:31:27 PM
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most fans should roar when you first crank your car in the morning for
a short period of time, this is an easy way to check. it does that
because the oil has settled to the bottom overnight. if any oil is
leaking out around the shaft you should replace. it will only get worse.
ap |
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JDP
Commander Member
USA
8865 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2009 : 3:50:24 PM
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There is not a thermostatic replacement available any more. The repo's work, but are a different design.
JDP/Maryland
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jclary
Golden Hawk Member
USA
912 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2009 : 4:14:22 PM
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For the ones that I have had to go bad. While the fan is still warm
after driving...you can grasp the fan and it will wobble on the shaft.
That is a good indicator that the viscous drive has given up the ghost. |
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jimmijim8
Commander Member
USA
1067 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2009 : 4:20:55 PM
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Yours is bad. Try to find an NOS replacement. As John says, the
replacements are non thermostatic. Just oil filled. Not real durable.
Some one needs to come up with a better replacement. A thermostatic
brand x adaptation, replacement. Anybody up to the task or has it been
accomplished. The Studebaker fan is made to accept the larger bolt
pattern clutch. I suppose one might be able to redrill the water pump
flange and pullies to accept a GM fan clutch. jimmijim |
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Alan
Commander Member
1314 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2009 : 5:09:29 PM
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75-80 Caddy, the pilot hole has to be enlarged .005". Easy job with a hand reamer. |
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jimmijim8
Commander Member
USA
1067 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2009 : 5:34:06 PM
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quote: Originally posted by Alan
75-80 Caddy, the pilot hole has to be enlarged .005". Easy job with a hand reamer.
Nice to know. thanks jimmijim |
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Mike Van Veghten
Commander Member
USA
1211 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2009 : 8:03:29 PM
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That fan ISN'T nesessarally bad...!
A BIG question you didn't offer...and no one asked - Was the fan hot when you noticed it running on?
That's what they are supposed to do when hot...!
When they are cold/cool, they are tight and...yes, should stop pretty quickly. When hot, they loosen up and spin a few rotations after shut down.
Read up on them..
Mike |
Edited by - Mike Van Veghten on 08/04/2009 8:04:02 PM |
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Dan White
Golden Hawk Member
USA
731 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2009 : 8:06:16 PM
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Dan Miller in GA makes or did make a kit for Hawks to use a
thermostatic fan from a Jaguar. I have the kit on and it works fine.
The clutch is from a '85 to '87 XJ6 or '85 to '92 XJS.
You can reach Dan:
Dan Miller: alexmil@comcast.net
I
believe he said that there was not quite enough clearance to use this
on a Lark. He was selling these at the 2007 Nationals in SB.
The NAPA part # is 261306
Fan Clutch - Thermostatic
Front Part: TEM 261306 Product Line: NAPA Temp Products Price Unit 44.99 Each
Attributes Fan Clutch Bolt Circle Diameter : 1.39" Fan Clutch Fan Mount Diameter : 2.62" Fan Clutch Fan Mount Height : 2.25" Fan Clutch Height : 2.67" Fan Clutch Overall Diameter : 7.23" Fan Clutch Pilot Diameter : .75" Fan Clutch Rotation : Clockwise Fan Clutch Style : 7" Heavy Duty Fan Clutch Type : Thermal Warranty Limited Lifetime
Dan White 64 R1 GT 64 R2 GT |
Edited by - Dan White on 08/04/2009 8:22:42 PM |
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maxpower1954
Cruiser Member
108 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2009 : 11:48:59 PM
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quote: Originally posted by Alan
75-80 Caddy, the pilot hole has to be enlarged .005". Easy job with a hand reamer.
Thanks
Alan, but there are at least two different fan clutches for Caddies for
those years on the NAPA site - can you narrow it down a little more?
Russ Farris |
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62champ
Cruiser Member
247 Posts |
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foobar
Golden Hawk Member
778 Posts |
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hotrodstude
Regal Member
USA
318 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2009 : 09:06:05 AM
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why bother just put a regular flex fan on the engine. you may need a
shroud.but i have never had any problems with this system.works for me.
2006,f-150,2x4,v-6,5-speed manual,8ft bed, will post stude info when i get it on the road. |
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Alan
Commander Member
1314 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2009 : 12:59:05 PM
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Off the 425, 472, 500 CI. Don't try the ones off the 4.1 aluminum motor. |
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maxpower1954
Cruiser Member
108 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2009 : 3:54:14 PM
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Thank you! Russ Farris |
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alpayed
Champion Member
Australia
30 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 04:11:28 AM
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I am a bit confused here. The fan as mentioned by Bob (above) installed
on my Hawk works differently to what is described above. When cold
it simply freewheels. As the engine temperature rises the thermo spring
on the front which is subject to the hot air coming through the
radiator activates the coupling (progressively) When it is very hot the
coupling is almost locked giving the most cooling. To my way of
thinking you should be able to spin fan freely, (or with little effort)
when the engine is cold. Only when it is hot do you need cooling. Allan
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foobar
Golden Hawk Member
778 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 08:29:51 AM
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Speaking about function.... I HAD a straight 6 blade fan on my GT Hawk and at road speed, was pretty noisy (3.31 rear).
Earler
this year, a T-bow viscous fan coupling and 6 blade, was installed
because I wanted to reduce noise and I knew the viscous part would
reduce the rpm of the fan, which it does.
But, the fan turns
with the engine, all the time. It just turns slower because of the
fluid medium. When its hot, the fluid is thinner, but it still pulls a
lot of air and the speed and fluxuates with engine rpm.
I
believe the point of a viscous coupling is ONLY to reduce the fan speed
and allow a larger fan to pull more air thru the radiator.
The
function of a thermostatic coupling should be more akin to what Alan
said, however, I just gave an original 63 Lark fan/thermostatic clutch
to a friend. It was in prime condition and did have a definite
resistance to turning it by hand.
Once both types of couplings
are functionally worn out, the fan will spin, but do no work or very
little. At that point, it is no longer being driven by engine force,
just going along for the ride due to frictional reasons.
Bob Johnstone www.studebaker-info.org
64 GT Hawk 55 President State Sedan 70 Avanti (R3) |
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Bob Bryant
Cruiser Member
USA
155 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 08:30:29 AM
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Not sure if this info is helpful. My viscous fan clutch on my Avanti
R-1 was tired. I bought a used unit which did not work as well as the
one it replaced, so I changed to a bi-metallic clutch.
In 2006
it was my understanding that viscous fan clutches were no longer
available and new units off the shelf of the vendors I contacted were
bi-metallic. Both types were referred to as Part #1560257. My new unit
needed a little filing, as the milling of the slots for the bolts
attaching it to the water pump had not removed quite enough metal.
Obviously, there can be some NOS viscous units out there if you can
locate them.
It would be interesting to know the manufacturing source of the bi-metallic clutches.
"It's like deja vu all over again."--Yogi Berra |
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Dan White
Golden Hawk Member
USA
731 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 08:40:01 AM
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Bob I think you have it reversed. Bi-metallic or thermostatic whatever
you want to call them are no longer available. There may be some NOS
out there somewhere but I have not seen any. All the vendors to my
knowledge are selling the viscous coupled units now.
Dan White 64 R1 GT 64 R2 GT |
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hotrodstude
Regal Member
USA
318 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 11:31:15 AM
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was the 6 -bladed fan fixed blades? i use flex fans no noise the fan
flattens out at high rpm. the blades are flexable but you have to watch
putting them on the edges are razor sharp.always wear gloves leather
gloves.
2006,f-150,2x4,v-6,5-speed manual,8ft bed, will post stude info when i get it on the road. |
Edited by - hotrodstude on 08/06/2009 11:31:58 AM |
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Bob Bryant
Cruiser Member
USA
155 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 12:16:53 PM
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Dan: Thanks for the clarification. My Avanti manual from SNM refers to
a viscous fan drive and I assumed the manual content had not been
revised. It describes the fluid as being silicone. I won't tell anyone
again I have a thermostatic fan clutch! Bob
quote: Originally posted by Dan White
Bob
I think you have it reversed. Bi-metallic or thermostatic whatever you
want to call them are no longer available. There may be some NOS out
there somewhere but I have not seen any. All the vendors to my
knowledge are selling the viscous coupled units now.
Dan White 64 R1 GT 64 R2 GT
"It's like deja vu all over again."--Yogi Berra |
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Jolly-John
Champion Member
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 2:43:42 PM
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Hi, Gang. The Flex-Fan has another advantage no one has mentioned
yet...its use significantly reduces the weight on the water pump
bearing and shaft. This is especially important for the R series
engines, where you have that heavy multi-groove pulley to contend with,
plus the weight of the fan drive and the metal fan. I know the Avanti
water pump has a beefed-up snout, but I still find the original R
engine fan set-up is hard on water pumps.
I have two extra
Flex-Fans available for purchase. One is new-in-box, and the other is
an excellent used Flex-Fan. These are the genuine Flex-Fan brand, and
have the correct diameter for our Stude V-8s. These are made totally of
fiberglass (no razor-sharp metal blade edges). I have used these very
successfully on my Avantis in the past. Just private message or email
me, if someone wants more info, a photo, or a price for each. Thanks.
John in Wisconsin |
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bige
Golden Hawk Member
USA
789 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2009 : 4:03:19 PM
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I can't find any reading that suggests that what you are saying is correct.
I've
never had a bad fan clutch allow the fan to continue its rotation on a
hot engine when it's shut off nor a bad one stop spinning.
This
has been my experience on both thermostatically controlled and RPM
type. In fact it has been my experience only a month ago with a
defective unit on my '76 Chrysler. Installed a new Evercool unit and
noticed the car running hotter than before. After changing the
thermostat because I assumed it was something other than the new fan
clutch I relented and observed the clutch's operation when the engine
was good and hot. It did exactly what a bad clutch will do, spin the
fan much slower than a good one will and continue to spin when the
engine is stopped. I replaced it and have a nice fast spinning fan, a
cool engine and a clutch that locks up tight enough to halt the fan in
1/4 turn when I shut the car off.
I'd rather be wrong with a cool running engine than right overheated by the side of the road.
quote: Originally posted by Mike Van Veghten
That fan ISN'T nesessarally bad...!
A BIG question you didn't offer...and no one asked - Was the fan hot when you noticed it running on?
That's what they are supposed to do when hot...!
When they are cold/cool, they are tight and...yes, should stop pretty quickly. When hot, they loosen up and spin a few rotations after shut down.
Read up on them..
Mike
On its way to a 15.097 Island Dragway Great Meadows NJ Spring 2006. |
Edited by - bige on 08/06/2009 4:05:16 PM |
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alpayed
Champion Member
Australia
30 Posts |
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60ragtop
Starlight Member
72 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2009 : 2:38:54 PM
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I installed a viscous drive and 5 blade fan on my 60 convertible to try
to fix a problem with the engine running hot at idle, long stop lights,
in traffic, etc. Problem not solved, but I noticed the fan continues to
spin a few revolutions after the engine is shut off. Based on most
comments here, this means the viscous drive is not working as intended.
Correct? I only ask because there seems to be some difference of
opinion.
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GTtim
Golden Hawk Member
USA
684 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2009 : 2:50:35 PM
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I think the link above summarizes it nicely, if the fan/clutch spins easily, it ain't workin.
Tim K. '64 R2 GT Hawk |
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60ragtop
Starlight Member
72 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2009 : 3:10:39 PM
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Yep, I shoulda read that before I posted....maybe one of those flex
fans would solve the problem without undue noise. Not that I mind noise
all that much. |
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jimmijim8
Commander Member
USA
1067 Posts |
Posted - 08/14/2009 : 4:01:25 PM
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Thermatics from Canada were the original manufacturers of the Stude fan clutches. jimmijim
Stude Junkie+++++++Do it right the f$$$$ Time. Never mind. Just do it right. When youre done your done. You'll know it. |
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Kenmike2
Starlight Member
USA
75 Posts |
Posted - 08/16/2009 : 11:41:50 PM
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I use a fan/viscous hub/spacer from a 1978 Plymouth Volare, with 318
engine. This is a bolt-in and fits perfectly on the 56-57 Hawk
vehicles. And possibly on many others. REgards Ken Michael |
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